Comments on: Occam’s Razor in the Middle East http://www.thecherryorchard.org/2006/11/29/occams-razor-in-the-middle-east/ A Fresh Look at News, Politics and History Fri, 10 Feb 2012 10:47:00 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.0.3 by: Literary Monthly http://www.thecherryorchard.org/2006/11/29/occams-razor-in-the-middle-east/#comment-871 Fri, 08 Dec 2006 19:10:35 +0000 http://www.thecherryorchard.org/2006/11/29/occams-razor-in-the-middle-east/#comment-871 Links to CherryOrchard and more at DailyKos.com. "The Pen is Mightier" by Calico Kid. Add comments to keep the discussion going. Links to CherryOrchard and more at DailyKos.com. “The Pen is Mightier” by Calico Kid. Add comments to keep the discussion going.

]]> by: Stokely http://www.thecherryorchard.org/2006/11/29/occams-razor-in-the-middle-east/#comment-869 Thu, 07 Dec 2006 18:09:22 +0000 http://www.thecherryorchard.org/2006/11/29/occams-razor-in-the-middle-east/#comment-869 I have to agree with much of this, both from the practical and theoretical aspects. And I applaud both the formulations and the principles. But let me add some things to Occam & Asher: 1. By mutual assent, truth has always had to be fairly obvious, for us to acknowledge it. 2. Was it Trotsky who said - there’s no such thing as a revolutionary with a full belly. 3. Israelis and Palestinians have a sixty year history of working side by side, as long as there is an equitable economic system in place. 4. Could someone trace the history of Bin Laden’s disfavor with the US? We created him in anti-Russian Afghanistan. But was his turn against us caused by our selling F-16’s, etc., to the Saud consortium/dictatorship? Was the Carlyle Group-Saud union, a contributing factor? 5. And finally - the $billion a week we spend in Iraq - couldn’t that be used to fill everyone’s bellies and thus end revolution? I have to agree with much of this, both from the practical and theoretical aspects. And I applaud both the formulations and the principles. But let me add some things to Occam & Asher:

1. By mutual assent, truth has always had to be fairly obvious, for us to acknowledge it.
2. Was it Trotsky who said - there’s no such thing as a revolutionary with a full belly.
3. Israelis and Palestinians have a sixty year history of working side by side, as long as there is an equitable economic system in place.
4. Could someone trace the history of Bin Laden’s disfavor with the US? We created him in anti-Russian Afghanistan. But was his turn against us caused by our selling F-16’s, etc., to the Saud consortium/dictatorship? Was the Carlyle Group-Saud union, a contributing factor?
5. And finally - the $billion a week we spend in Iraq - couldn’t that be used to fill everyone’s bellies and thus end revolution?

]]> by: brooklyn http://www.thecherryorchard.org/2006/11/29/occams-razor-in-the-middle-east/#comment-863 Sun, 03 Dec 2006 06:17:58 +0000 http://www.thecherryorchard.org/2006/11/29/occams-razor-in-the-middle-east/#comment-863 Jim -- well, "maybe? maybe not?" is where the world seems to be stuck. I think there's too much at stake right now to let it rest at "maybe? maybe not?". The point of this article is that I'm suggesting the world wise up -- that we stop allowing dumb ethnic propaganda distract us from the most obvious and most important fact: war is a blight upon humanity. Jim — well, “maybe? maybe not?” is where the world seems to be stuck. I think there’s too much at stake right now to let it rest at “maybe? maybe not?”. The point of this article is that I’m suggesting the world wise up — that we stop allowing dumb ethnic propaganda distract us from the most obvious and most important fact: war is a blight upon humanity.

]]> by: Jim http://www.thecherryorchard.org/2006/11/29/occams-razor-in-the-middle-east/#comment-861 Sun, 03 Dec 2006 03:53:04 +0000 http://www.thecherryorchard.org/2006/11/29/occams-razor-in-the-middle-east/#comment-861 What does it mean to say that Islamic fundamentalism has nothing to do with religion? Islam is a religion. "Fundamentalism" is a term describing religious movements and sects, specifically, "A usually religious movement or point of view characterized by a return to fundamental principles, by rigid adherence to those principles, and often by intolerance of other views and opposition to secularism." If you mean that the terrorism in the Middle East has nothing to do with religion, I still disagree. To say that greed and hunger for power drive war does nothing to dispute the assertion that there are strong religious connections. I also find your axiomatic way of approaching things less than helpful ("Radical political movements occur when the fault lines between the “haves” and “have-nots” in any society grow too vast, and when large segments of a population feel disenfranchised and abused by their leaders." -- um, maybe? maybe not? This is not a self-evident truth.) What does it mean to say that Islamic fundamentalism has nothing to do with religion? Islam is a religion. “Fundamentalism” is a term describing religious movements and sects, specifically, “A usually religious movement or point of view characterized by a return to fundamental principles, by rigid adherence to those principles, and often by intolerance of other views and opposition to secularism.”

If you mean that the terrorism in the Middle East has nothing to do with religion, I still disagree. To say that greed and hunger for power drive war does nothing to dispute the assertion that there are strong religious connections.

I also find your axiomatic way of approaching things less than helpful (”Radical political movements occur when the fault lines between the “haves” and “have-nots” in any society grow too vast, and when large segments of a population feel disenfranchised and abused by their leaders.” — um, maybe? maybe not? This is not a self-evident truth.)

]]> by: Алекса́ндр http://www.thecherryorchard.org/2006/11/29/occams-razor-in-the-middle-east/#comment-860 Sun, 03 Dec 2006 02:37:57 +0000 http://www.thecherryorchard.org/2006/11/29/occams-razor-in-the-middle-east/#comment-860 It was only when I lay there on rotting prison straw that I sensed within myself the first stirrings of good. Gradually it was disclosed to me that the line separating good and evil passes not through states, nor between classes, nor between political parties either, but right through every human heart, and through all human hearts. This line shifts. Inside us, it oscillates with the years. Even within hearts overwhelmed by evil, one small bridgehead of good is retained; and even in the best of all hearts, there remains a small corner of evil. It was only when I lay there on rotting prison straw that I sensed within myself the first stirrings of good. Gradually it was disclosed to me that the line separating good and evil passes not through states, nor between classes, nor between political parties either, but right through every human heart, and through all human hearts. This line shifts. Inside us, it oscillates with the years. Even within hearts overwhelmed by evil, one small bridgehead of good is retained; and even in the best of all hearts, there remains a small corner of evil.

]]> by: Bill Ectric http://www.thecherryorchard.org/2006/11/29/occams-razor-in-the-middle-east/#comment-858 Sat, 02 Dec 2006 06:29:36 +0000 http://www.thecherryorchard.org/2006/11/29/occams-razor-in-the-middle-east/#comment-858 This makes a lot of sense. I'm going to link it to my blog. By the way, have you noticed the subtle message that the Bush administration has "leaked" out? Now suddenly (according to them), all the chaos is the Iraqi Prime Ministers fault. This makes a lot of sense. I’m going to link it to my blog.

By the way, have you noticed the subtle message that the Bush administration has “leaked” out? Now suddenly (according to them), all the chaos is the Iraqi Prime Ministers fault.

]]> by: anemone http://www.thecherryorchard.org/2006/11/29/occams-razor-in-the-middle-east/#comment-845 Fri, 01 Dec 2006 17:07:35 +0000 http://www.thecherryorchard.org/2006/11/29/occams-razor-in-the-middle-east/#comment-845 yeah -- war, fundamentalism, fanatism... they're about survival and identity. about power and territory. about greed and suffering. about fear. they are about humans trying to feel safe by saving food, space, myths, by claiming a piece of earth, a hunting ground, an idea, a truth their own. religion and belief systems are merely used as vehicles to get there. they are tools. their deployment and use are symptoms of human factors. yeah — war, fundamentalism, fanatism… they’re about survival and identity. about power and territory. about greed and suffering. about fear.
they are about humans trying to feel safe by saving food, space, myths, by claiming a piece of earth, a hunting ground, an idea, a truth their own.

religion and belief systems are merely used as vehicles to get there. they are tools. their deployment and use are symptoms of human factors.

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